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Post by Xuser on Oct 29, 2017 9:29:24 GMT -5
Just an interesting question I thought of.
What I mean is, in order to beat a really hard demon, which aspect do you need the most? Skill, luck, muscle memory/ consistency? All of these are important and it varies depending on the level, but I'm asking what is the aspect you need the most, in general.
SKILL: the experience you've already had in the game before starting the level. You can't do Erebus after stereo madness.
Counter argument: mostly, a lack of skill can be covered up with enough practice. I mean, we have seen people doing cataclysm after nine circles and getting far.
LUCK: because sometimes it's luck based whether you jump in time, and it can be a roll of a dice whether your hand respond at the correct time. There are bugs too which sometimes you need luck to get through
Counter argument: luck isn't as important if you already know the layout of the level. It's far more important when you're trying to one-attempt easy levels, because you don't know what's coming up. It's more reliable to know where to press rather than relying on luck to help you make the jump. Besides, in order for it to work it needs to happen at every part, and that's not likely.
MUSCLE MEMORY/CONSISTENCY: basically, your ability to continually pass parts over and over again, and having your hand start functioning automatically. It's good to have everything part down and happen automatically, right?
Counter argument: it would take way to long to establish a completely working muscle memory on a level, so it might be better to just rely on something else, like a lucky fluke. You only need to beat a level once, and that's it.
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Post by Subzero on Oct 29, 2017 9:41:34 GMT -5
Honestly, I feel that it's both skill and memory. Luck with extreme demons is a rarity without a doubt.
But anyway, I feel that you need both of these because the balance of these at such a high difficulty makes for a very strenuous challenge. Of course, a level can rely more on one than the other and still maintain its status of extreme demon (as shown with Killbot and Bloodbath), but I feel that the hardest levels of them all balance both of these to make what can only be described as an utterly gruesome hell.
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Post by Dragon on Oct 29, 2017 10:13:02 GMT -5
It’s a balance of everything.
Skill: you obviously need to have the skill to beat these types of levels
Memory: it’s almost impossible to beat a hard demon immediately, you need to memorize the level’s layout and tricks to beat it
Luck: some levels are buggy and inconsistent *cough*devil vortex *cough* so you need luck to pass it.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2017 10:29:05 GMT -5
It is actually based off skill
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Post by Ezel on Oct 30, 2017 4:45:01 GMT -5
Honestly I think that skill and luck doesn't matter as long as you have next to no consistency on a level. It's the most important thing IMO.
When someone is consistent, they can pass a part over and over without much problems. This often requires muscle memory, which means that you can replicate the same patterns over and over. Unfortunately we know that some part can be inconsistent due to weird gameplay and bugs, and that's what makes some people unable to beat some hard levels fast.
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1,359 posts
Discord: cirphlyx#2104
Favorite Level: Crossroads
Hardest Demon: Niflheim
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Post by Cirphlyx on Oct 30, 2017 8:25:37 GMT -5
depends on the level really. no one answer. also depends on the player. i personally am a muscle memory player. i know a lot of players are. there is an element of luck and skill, but those really affect how quick you beat the level and have less effect on whether or not you can beat it.
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Post by Denoxi on Oct 30, 2017 8:56:09 GMT -5
Consistency - Most extreme demons right now are filled with straight flies and shit transitions so you need consistency Memory - You need memory to improve your consistency, memorizing the level's transitions and gameplay will improve your consistency.
Basically these two apply to skill xd
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311 posts
Clans: Qualia, Invertia
Favorite Level: Future Circles
Hardest Demon: Excessive Compliment
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Post by UbiVoiD on Nov 12, 2017 2:58:53 GMT -5
All three really. Muscle memory/consistency is a necessity with most Hard Demons and above, skill helps you quickly adjust if you make a minor error with an input, and just helps you complete the level faster and luck is, well, luck. Fluking a level requires that, mixed with skill obviously.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2017 3:15:59 GMT -5
Skill tbh. Even if you had the best memory in the world, but no skill, you wouldn’t be able to beat hard demons like Supersonic because they require you to be precise and accurate with timings in many parts which only game skill can help you with.
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311 posts
Clans: Qualia, Invertia
Favorite Level: Future Circles
Hardest Demon: Excessive Compliment
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Post by UbiVoiD on Nov 12, 2017 3:28:01 GMT -5
Skill can be developed though over time, it's not just all natural to be able to beat an Extreme demon. That being said, physical and mental limitations can inhibit said skill from reaching high enough.
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210 posts
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Post by Dash0219 on Nov 14, 2017 10:07:05 GMT -5
Mostly skill but i fluked Clubstep v2 95%after getting 57
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Post by Electroanimator on Nov 14, 2017 11:04:48 GMT -5
I would say memory for the following reasons: I'm not a very skilled player, but after I've memorized some levels' gameplay, I do really well on them. Like Sidestep (ik it's easy/medium demon but it's much harder than any demon I've completed). After memorizing the layout, I've gotten 84%, even though I have really low scores on levels that are considered easier (like having 21% on X, 25% on yStep, and 33% on Sky Realm), even though they are much easier than Sidestep.
Someone could say the same if they had spent several thousand attempts on Windy Landscape and had beaten it, even though they hadn't completed easier demons like Jawbreaker, Nine Circles, Dead Moon, etc. It's because they memorized Windy Landscape, and not the others.
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Post by Derpy on Nov 14, 2017 11:22:05 GMT -5
It's more of persistence than anything
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Post by Electroanimator on Nov 14, 2017 11:24:24 GMT -5
It's more of persistence than anything True tbh That's more or less what I was saying, because persistence helps you memorize.
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Post by Derpy on Nov 14, 2017 11:31:25 GMT -5
It's more of persistence than anything True tbh That's more or less what I was saying, because persistence helps you memorize. Well coming from someone with 440 demons it takes a lot of persistence to get your first few beaten, but after you've done around 30-40 I'd say you can pretty easily knock most demons out in a few hours.
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